As I understand it, the english heraldic term would be "tierced in point?"
(EDIT 10/19/2012: further discussion clarifies things in the comments for this post. - Jeff)
Tuesday, October 16, 2012
Mantelado en Punta on Columbus's Arms
On October 12, 2012, Rodrigo Lopez-Portillo Y Lancaster-Jones posted the following image on the Heraldry Society group page on Facebook labeled as the coat of arms of Columbus & the Dukes of Veragua:
In response to the posted image, Kaj Malachowski asked "why is the "bottom-inescutcheon" upside-down?" to which Xavi Garcia replied: "Kaj Malachowski, this is not a "bottom-inescutcheon" reversed. This is an ordinary called in Spanish "mantelado en punta" and in French "mantelé in pointe".
As I understand it, the english heraldic term would be "tierced in point?"
(EDIT 10/19/2012: further discussion clarifies things in the comments for this post. - Jeff)
As I understand it, the english heraldic term would be "tierced in point?"
(EDIT 10/19/2012: further discussion clarifies things in the comments for this post. - Jeff)
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Jeffrey, I don't think so - Fox Davies' "The Art of Heraldry" has an illustration of "tierced in point" (plate IX, no. 54), but does say "54, 55,
ReplyDelete56, and 57 are forms which, being applications of the point, are not likely to be met with in British armory, but adopting the term and figure of the point they would be blazoned : 54. Per pale gules and azure, a point or. An alternative blazon would be tierced in point gules,
or, and azure." - Page 109
(Incidentally, the internet archive has a beautiful, text searchable, scan of "The Art of Heraldry" at http://archive.org/details/artofheraldryenc00foxd ).
Having said that, I'm not sure what your "Mantelado" would be in english, it may not exist, but I will keep looking!
Thank you very much for the link, sir! It's invaluable to a working herald in the Society for Creative Anachronism.
DeleteThe nearest I can find is "point in point in point", but this curves inwards, not outwards. See two examples:
ReplyDelete"The British Herald, or Cabinet of Armorial Bearings" (Vol III) (http://archive.org/details/britishheraldor01robsgoog), diagram on PDF page no 308 (plate 2, fig 24), corresponding entry is "Fillet" (PDF page no. 56)
Also, "Encyclopedia Heraldica vol I, (http://archive.org/details/encyclopaediaher01berr) PDF page 508, under the entry for "point", with the diagram in vol III (http://archive.org/details/encyclopaediaher03berr) on PDF page 40, Plate VII fig. 9.
However, neither of these curve outwards like the mantelado, so overall I don't think there is a direct english equivalent.
Do you think I should get out more? - Karl
Lol Karl, getting out more is overrated! :P
ReplyDeleteSo I went back to the Facebook group and asked: "How would you describe "mantelado en punta" in English... what would be the best translation? I'm recently told that tierced in point isn't a good translation of this."
Xavi Garcia replied: "In Itialian this is a "mantellato", in Catalan is "gaiat", in Spanish is "mantelado", in French "mantelé", in English: "manteld", in German: "gemanteld". And "punta" in English is base."
So basically there is no English word for mantelado because "manteld" is not an English word. I'm pretty sure it's just a permutation of the English mantle (cloak/cape shape) which is basically what a tierce is in form anyhow. Having this occur "en punta" can be nothing other than "-in point" quite literally. The actual design on this particular mantelado looks like an inverted one of course.
My first gut inclination is to just say this is an example of typical 16th century craziness and it's simply a warped tierce gone wild (for lack of a better description).
I inquired at the American Heraldry Society forums and Joseph McMillan shared the following response: "'Mantelado en punta' describes the format of the entire shield. It probably translates roughly as 'chapé abased,' but in English I would use the term 'point in point.'"
ReplyDeleteKarl, this seems to agree with your find. :)
Hi Jeffrey,
DeleteMy source is this:
http://www.heraldica.org/cgi-bin/translatf.pl?words=mantele&exact=1&orilang=1&lang=0
Except this translator, my dictionaries don't translate "mantelado" in English. I think that the English heraldry don't use this ordinary.
This "mantelé" is the same that you can watch in the coat of arms of the Kingdom of Spain:
http://dibujoheraldico.blogspot.com.es/2011/10/escudo-de-espana.html
The Spain's coat of arms has a "mantelado en punta bajado redondeado" and the coat of arms of Columbus has a "mantelado en punta bajado conopial". The difference is the shape: rounded VS ogee.
Xavi, thankyou for clarifying the "mantelado en punta" on Columbus' arms as "bajado conopial."
Delete